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Thread: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cajunsmike View Post
    Very good point here. Too often teams (Cajuns included and perhaps more so than most) shoot contested three pointers (a 20 percent shot at best) and don't work for open mid range shots. That can be a 40 percent shot if executed properly. That is 80 points in a 100 possessions vs 60 on contested threes. Defenses want to run you off the three point line and contest the basket. That means mid range is open. You just have to recognize that and practice it more for success. Of course transition changes everything and you can get open threes off your defense. Frank Bartley was the Louisiana player of the year based upon his ability to get open in that situation. Bottom line is the open shot is the best shot.
    I agree, the open shot is the best shot, no matter where it is on the floor. I was just looking at some stats for Jalen Johnson. His 3pt shooting% has dropped from 39% as a sophomore at St. Louis to 27% this season. Now the 3pt line has been pushed back in that time but that is a pretty significant drop. He is also not "jacking up" more 3pt shots here, it has actually slightly dropped from 5.7 attempts per 40 at St. Louis to 5.4 this year. It would lead me to believe he had more open and clean looks in that offense than what he has had here.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephyr View Post
    Your midrange percentage goes up when its an open shot. I'm not anti-3 point shot. I'm anti bad shot. It's not that hard. You talk about statistically but you aren't looking at shot selection. An open 15 foot jumper is much easier to hit and rebound than a contested 3. UNC has won 3 national championships in the last 15 years without ever being a premier 3 point shooting team. They score inside and in transition and then they out rebound you. In the NBA, ALL of the best players in the league are also the best players in the midrange and use it often, especially in playoff time.
    Of course midrange shooting goes up when you're open. And guess what? 3pt shooting percentage also goes up when you're open.

    An open look from 15ft is only slightly easier to hit than an open look from 3 which is why you try to take the open 3 when you can.

    Obviously nobody has a strategy to take contested shots from any spot on the court. Sometimes the midrange shot is the best available option so you take it, but I promise you almost nobody is game planning to create midrange shots.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephyr View Post
    So using your reasoning, why don't we just put up 60 3's per game?
    Because the highest pps shots come within <5ft of the basket, not the 3pt line.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by CajunRebel View Post
    Of course midrange shooting goes up when you're open. And guess what? 3pt shooting percentage also goes up when you're open.

    An open look from 15ft is only slightly easier to hit than an open look from 3 which is why you try to take the open 3 when you can.

    Obviously nobody has a strategy to take contested shots from any spot on the court. Sometimes the midrange shot is the best available option so you take it, but I promise you almost nobody is game planning to create midrange shots.
    Which is why a lot of people are losing interest in the game. Who want to watch a team pass the ball around the perimeter 3/4 time and then jack up a 25 footer. It not at all entertaining. I wish the 3 pt. Shot would be banned, so we could go back to the way basketball was meant to be played.

  5. #105
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by CajunRebel View Post
    ... I promise you almost nobody is game planning to create midrange shots.
    If they were, I suspect it would create more open 3's

  6. #106
    Cajunsmike is offline Ragin Cajuns of Louisiana Ragin' Cajuns Greatest Fan Ever
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by Localyokel View Post
    Which is why a lot of people are losing interest in the game. Who want to watch a team pass the ball around the perimeter 3/4 time and then jack up a 25 footer. It not at all entertaining. I wish the 3 pt. Shot would be banned, so we could go back to the way basketball was meant to be played.
    I agree over reliance on the three pointer tends to make people think the team approach to the game is being lost.

  7. #107
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatch View Post
    I agree, the open shot is the best shot, no matter where it is on the floor. I was just looking at some stats for Jalen Johnson. His 3pt shooting% has dropped from 39% as a sophomore at St. Louis to 27% this season. Now the 3pt line has been pushed back in that time but that is a pretty significant drop. He is also not "jacking up" more 3pt shots here, it has actually slightly dropped from 5.7 attempts per 40 at St. Louis to 5.4 this year. It would lead me to believe he had more open and clean looks in that offense than what he has had here.
    Well his issue is he can't move at all so he has to settle for the 3. He cant get by anyone on the perimeter and he is undersized when he is under the rim. He can make some nifty moves with his footwork inside sometimes but for the most part, he needs someone to create for him.

  8. #108
    Cajunsmike is offline Ragin Cajuns of Louisiana Ragin' Cajuns Greatest Fan Ever
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by cajuns80 View Post
    Well his issue is he can't move at all so he has to settle for the 3. He cant get by anyone on the perimeter and he is undersized when he is under the rim. He can make some nifty moves with his footwork inside sometimes but for the most part, he needs someone to create for him.
    He does have some limitations as you point out. However when we set plays for him to get the ball at the elbow he is fairly effective with the mid range shot. We need to do that more often for him. He also is a good free throw shooter as evidenced by him icing the game against Troy. He is more likely to get fouled on that elbow shot than he is shooting a three. I do think coaches believed he would shoot a higher three point percentage than he has. He was very effective from three while on the scout team last season. Has not translated to real games as much as was hoped.

  9. #109
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by Cajunsmike View Post
    He does have some limitations as you point out. However when we set plays for him to get the ball at the elbow he is fairly effective with the mid range shot. We need to do that more often for him. He also is a good free throw shooter as evidenced by him icing the game against Troy. He is more likely to get fouled on that elbow shot than he is shooting a three. I do think coaches believed he would shoot a higher three point percentage than he has. He was very effective from three while on the scout team last season. Has not translated to real games as much as was hoped.
    I agree about his midrange game but like you've stated in the past, coach doesn't care for that shot.

  10. #110
    Cajunsmike is offline Ragin Cajuns of Louisiana Ragin' Cajuns Greatest Fan Ever
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by cajuns80 View Post
    I agree about his midrange game but like you've stated in the past, coach doesn't care for that shot.
    In general he does not but he must be more willing to try it now based on plays run for Johnson near free throw line in last two games. Wish we would do it more often.

  11. #111
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by Cajunsmike View Post
    In general he does not but he must be more willing to try it now based on plays run for Johnson near free throw line in last two games. Wish we would do it more often.
    ESPECIALLY with how much zone we see since we are so poor from 3.

  12. #112
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by CajunVic View Post
    Wrong, again.
    Ummm, no good try though. The decision is not about money, at least not to a significant degree. The decision is about the administration being moderately happy with the program that Marlin runs and the "vote of confidence" that Maggard has given to many stating that the basketball program is on firm ground. People thought it was about money prior to finding out the true buyout amount.

  13. #113
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by CajunRebel View Post
    Because the highest pps shots come within <5ft of the basket, not the 3pt line.
    That's fine but we only get a handful of them per game. Just eliminate the entire midrange shot selection then.....

  14. #114
    CajunVic is offline Ragin Cajuns of Louisiana Ragin' Cajuns Greatest Fan Ever
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by zephyr View Post
    Ummm, no good try though. The decision is not about money, at least not to a significant degree. The decision is about the administration being moderately happy with the program that Marlin runs and the "vote of confidence" that Maggard has given to many stating that the basketball program is on firm ground. People thought it was about money prior to finding out the true buyout amount.
    Continue to fool yourself. It's about money and no, he will not say that. So . . . .

  15. #115
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by CajunEXPRESS View Post
    I can't tell you how many 95% shots(uncontested layups)are passed up, and instead the ball is passed to an open 3. Most of those are made, but 95% I'd take every play.
    I agree except I wish it was only so true. I see so many layups and uncontested 8 footers in the lane kicked out for a half contested 3 rather than one that is wide open.

  16. #116
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    Default Re: MBB: Louisiana vs South Alabama

    Quote Originally Posted by CajunRebel View Post
    Of course midrange shooting goes up when you're open. And guess what? 3pt shooting percentage also goes up when you're open.

    An open look from 15ft is only slightly easier to hit than an open look from 3 which is why you try to take the open 3 when you can.

    Obviously nobody has a strategy to take contested shots from any spot on the court. Sometimes the midrange shot is the best available option so you take it, but I promise you almost nobody is game planning to create midrange shots.
    Again, I would disagree that you are wrong in regards to gameplanning for mid range shots. Coaches run plays all the time for players to get a good look, again this is often in mid range. At the end of game, the coach wants to get the player the shot that is the most open and comfortable to them which may not be the 3.

    Also, teams normally are doing what they can to run perimeter shooters off the line more and more so open 3's are less frequent these days than open mid range shots

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